Kris welcomes Greg Graffin, front man for the punk band BAD RELIGION
On this track Kris welcomes GREG GRAFFIN, front man for the punk band BAD RELIGION, a band whose no nonsense approach and Do It Yourself spirit helped them rise to the top of the Punk scene in L.A. and far beyond. Greg discusses their new punk rock manifesto, “Do What You Want”, the band’s outlook on the state of the world, and the nearly fatal rock concert that was not widely covered by the media.
Excerpt from DO WHAT YOU WANT (Hatchette Book Group):
“We started playing the show,” Greg recalled, “and a big hole opened up in front of me on the dance floor and bodies started falling into the hole.” The people who had been standing in front of the stage disappeared into the space where the floor had been.
Bad Religion stopped playing and the people on the right side of the dance floor shouted in protest, unaware of what had hap- pened. But the screams of those who had fallen or were in danger of falling drowned them out. A huge cloud of dust rose from the lower level and people continued to tumble into the pit.
Special Thanks to GREG GRAFFIN AND TO THE ENTIRE BAND FOR THEIR SUPPORT. Thanks also to BRETT GURWITZ and EPITAPH RECORDS for the use of Bad Religion’s library of music, MICHAEL GIARRATANO and everyone at HATCHET BOOK GROUP.
To purchase the book, DO WHAT YOU WANT, CLICK HERE
To see what the band is up to next vist their OFFICIAL SITE.
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‘TEXT PROSE AND ROCK N ROLL’- is the only podcast dedicated to the written account of musicians. From artist memoirs to band bios, and anything in between. You'll hear first accounts from those who lived the lifestyle; a Book Club that rocks - literally.
It was Created, Hosted & Executive Produced by Kris Kosach.
It was Produced & Edited by Charlene Goto of Go-To Productions.
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BAD RELIGION INTERVIEW August 18, 2020
GREG GRAFFIN: Everyone started jumping up and down at the same time well the building a person couldn't support the weight of all those 3500 people jumping up and down and the floor of the dance floor cracked and below us it was a parking area so this venue was a theater on top of the hill underground parking.
KRIS KOSACH:
Is this timeline Text prose & rock and roll we talk with Greg Graffin, punk rock philosopher turned Ivy league lecturer and lead singer of the seminal punk band Bad Religion about their unconventional rises in indie music, their time with a major label and avoiding a nearly fatal concert tragedy that you have probably never heard about. My name's Kris Kosach. I created this program to highlight the written account of music from memoirs to band bios and the occasional rock doc, we are the book club the rocks literally. This is Text Prose & RocknRoll.
Track 9: Bad Religion
Kris Kosach:
If you've been listening to our show for a while you probably know how this format goes but this time I'd like to do something a little bit different Hey it's Kris. After reading Bad Religion's music biography do what you want and then speaking with front man Greg Graffin and I decided I wanted to make this episode of text prose and rock and roll a little bit different from all the rest the book -which can be found on Hatcher by the way- tells the story of the band's do it yourself approach which took great and tons of work of the year. it's a truly honest account of their journey and so in that spirit during this episode I'm gonna let it roll exactly the way it was with a little bit of music in there too for good measure he went a little something like this. Your professor is that biological evolution or evolutionary biology the other departments are called evolutionary biology I teach evolution at the at Cornell everybody in those departments you know they are evolutionists very excellent so I'm going to kind of keep that evolution theme throughout our interview a little bit like like like I'm sure everybody else does but you you talk about the evolution of punk a little bit in that in the book of course we're talking about do what you want and it's by the entire band here's what I find fascinating punk has always had 2 schools of thought right there's like this angry is this wrong empty chemical a mindset and then there is this thought provoking revolutionary angry. A critical thinking Avenue as well and you guys come from the latter of course. But when you started you were a bunch of teenage high school punks so where did that come from was Woodland Hills kind of a hot bed of academics and world class people. Well I mean I can only speak. I can't generalize except to say that the guys in the band you know we're always interested in heavy topics even in our use mine came from growing up in an academic household and being exposed to you know all of the users youthful movements that the students on campus were were. Creating and just being around university people I mean that's what you're expected to. Talk about is heavy things you know and how's it gonna affect of the culture and you know things that are going to have an impact in like education. So that's what motivated me and even though we thought of ourselves as hardcore punk rockers we always knew when we wrote a song that we wanted to include some of that stuff. Yeah cultural grist that's going to be able to carry us through because we didn't we weren't interested in capitalizing on the moment as much as a capitalizing on which ideas and ideas that were universal in human suffering you know human the human experience so from the very earliest album. When we asked sarcastically how could hell be any worse you know with a picture of Hollywood on that was kind of a timeless question and we were kind of a bunch of. Many. Philosophers interested in asking big questions even though we couldn't answer the. What can you answer them now probably not. Learn the more I know why you don't know. And so in the beginning the book talks a lot about how you cut it D. I. wide everything before that was even kind of an expression you created epitaph you to distribute your your music which is it can continue to be very independent you created your own studio to record everything. But back in those days thinking it very independently did you guys even try to get a big label if from the beginning or did you always kind of want to do it yourself from the get go the book doesn't talk about that. Well don't forget of the Ramones were on a major label. The dead boys were on a major label. You know we there were but we are I think you know. We even thought of slash records you know even though it was in the it was a pretty important label and we always wish that someone would pay attention to us and the truth is nobody did so. You know being industrious. Actually you know brat coming from a. A business household you know I was a businessman. He always. You always had you know do it all do it yourself DIY on his mind. You know I think that we were all behind that if we can make it work so. But I think it is it's a. It's a fantasy to say that we weren't interested of course we were interested man if you can get an album made and distributed it would be a big benefit if you have something important to say and we felt we did have some 47 so according that we're willing to do it ourselves. Yeah I have a boy did you guys did a creature the staff is Killin it. 40 years later it's been 4040 years talk about evolution is that freak you out a little bit to look back and think it's 40. Well of course I mean. Some day you too will get old and. There's a painting aging for me somewhere. And you look back and yeah if you have a lifter a good life it's had its ups and downs but the one thing everyone agrees on this man that was fast 40 years it has gone fast yes and I look back I'm in disbelief that. It's persisted for so long you know this thing. We called Bad Religion 40 years ago is still an active breeding thing. Yeah by many measures it's more popular now but I'd say every major it's more popular now than ever so do you think part part of your popularity was that new from epitaph to Atlantic we you're part of the big machine but they put you on radio stations across the country and put you in front of a lot more people of course you backed off of that when that when the big train left the station and you were no longer with Danny Goldberg or with Atlantic did you maintain all of that audience. It's hard to say I I think John when I look back on it. You know that it's really. Our top to the historians to decide whether or not that moves brought us to a wider audience I'm really close to the experience obviously so I didn't pay a lot of attention. To the your what would go down in history as the major cultural shifts at the time I paid attention to are we able to tour in more places and so when we we were on a land check in America North America but we were on so many for the rest of the world. I'm sorry music expanded our distribution greatly and we were meeting so many reps in every country playing in places we've never played before like Brazil. You know in parts of the US Scandinavia we hadn't been before. Now every job was growing at that time too so it's very again you got to leave it to the business historians to look at what might have happened. But certainly we experienced a large. Global distribution at that time instantly I'm done. By the way we're playing more cities in North America too with that landing distributing our records into every mall in every small town where. Also had great success is at that same time the offspring was. Getting huge and ram service getting here show. In many ways I look back at it. Do that does Brett he may have touched on it in the book a little bit about but you know it it did help epitaph focus their energies on an indie has to focus their energy on the expanding demand for bands like rancid and the offspring and by not having bad religion there you know cleared up a lot of the warehouse space for one. But also the manpower involved so I think we all worked out in the end but it's obviously other people to debate what that. You know yeah I'm. You talk about touring a lot in Europe and one thing I did not know and I wasn't in alternative radio when 20 first century digital boy came out and was blowing up all the alternative charts. I did not know the sand Sebastian story can you please tell that story for any other fans of yours including myself who didn't know that unless they read this book. Well yeah I mean that the we have maybe we played there once before but since a bastion Spain is just as gorgeous area in the north in the Atlantic Ocean. A beautiful place to play and we didn't even know there was a punching their what turned out there was. Huge Bad Religion following there and they put us in a venue. That probably. Could hold. 2000 people safely. Sold it to at least 3500 people. When does the show with. A song called recipe for hate and recipe for he goes into the middle portion of the chorus when the the song goes to half time and everyone starts jumping up and down at the same time. Well the building they put us in. He couldn't support the weight of all those 3500 people jumping up and down and the floor of the dance floor cracked and below us I do not know this. Hello us was a parking area garage so this venue was a theater on top of him underground parking. All I know is I'm singing the chorus of the song and in front of me a big hole opens up in the middle of the dance floor and bodies are falling into this whole like it's a black hole or something in the following 2 because there are 2 stories below them that are parked on this cement parking structure. He'll obviously. Those terrifying moments in my career. The whole getting bigger and bigger as more people fell into it before holding on trying not to fall down into a. In the whole job opening up and coming towards the stage. Morale Gillislee it stopped it before it reached the stage. And the people in the very front role were like clinging to the barricades. Holding on and I remember helping a bunch of them up on to the stage. And you know saying nice to meet you but get the hell out of here they were escorted I get or just ran out the back door but we went after we cleared all the people we realize this building is not safe so we went to our backstage area to the. The same level parking structure work tour bus ones. And we just stayed out there and watched for the next 6:00 hours as ambulances kept coming back and forth to this venue and so I don't recall I think one person might have died I know there's a lot of injuries. But to this day playing in San Sebastian younger you get fans. 30 years ago were at that show and 25 years whatever it's been and they are they always talk about that day so it's kind of a a badge of honor to say you were at that show yeah then visual from your P. O. V. must've been insane to just work with dust coming up never forget it it's just a glitch in this K. I get really worried when we play that song I really do deserve. Inevitably this the slam dancing slows down and everyone starts and then everyone gets into a rhythm and it's putting a Cork tremendous strain on the building. Most buildings can have more. The older buildings out there that have dance floors on them some of these dance floors like in the old. Like eagles ballroom in Milwaukee it was from the big band era I know there's one in Detroit it's like that too Fillmore in San Francisco is like that too they have those dance floors are built to move and to give way but I don't know if they were meant to give way to. Now netted out it would have been a different outcome I think legally if it happened in the United States to. I tried I tried at 1.during the reading of the book to which one on hatchet. To do one of those string analysis of all the people that came and went in your band and about 30 pages into doing this beautiful mind it's a kind of schedule I just got so confused I threw the book across the room. Gave up you've been the only constant through the whole thing I. Have you ever wanted to quit. Not really it's kind of like asking if you want to leave your family I mean. You know sometimes you think well yeah I guess you know they all pissed me off but. What what good is it going to do ultimately. Everyone eventually everyone who has quit the band has regretted it you know that's one thing I can say I'm done it doesn't mean that they aren't living good lives they are. Wait for them and I want them to move on to better things but but ultimately you know they could have done most stuck around and. You know so to me it's like quitting is not really an option in my book it's not some. I don't do that hello I'm like that a Jerry Maguire right I stick. I just did that for all you know I did that for my wife who makes me watch chick flicks so we are very much wire cord is pretty lame Hey that's that's weird to hear from you this like very well known punk rocker who's like say the world a world at. A wire coat incidentals of biting your tongue yes. Doing things that you don't really want to do. That's an example of. At least watching watching some movies that you know I really didn't want to watch finding a nugget of something redeeming about the movie that I could identify with yes marital evolution right those were. Well it is yeah I've been around the whole time and I've seen them coming to see him go but. But the truth is the core of the band is really always been there even though J. left for a year or 2 you know he was is rightfully the core of the band Brett you know even though he left for a time hi he was still in my in my own mind an estimation he was he was a partner and a part of the band so. You know I don't make too much of the people who sort of left and came back and stuff but you know I do you know I I do. People leave for different reasons at the end that's the one thing I've never tried just for someone or tried to meddle with their decisions because it's very personal and has to do with their own constitution so right. I'm. You say in the book that you won't like schedule new releases the band is still together but you don't have really a schedule you put things out regularly but you don't need more unless you have something to say. Damn man there's a lot to say right now are you working on some stuff. What we didn't know it so easy since the world got up ended in the last 8 months or 6 months. Whatever it's it's easy to forget about religion just put out an album in 2019. We did a lot to say are we still doing a lot of that I think still is relevant right now you know when we write an album it's because we feel like we have something relevant to say it's not just gonna that's not a flash in the pan that goes away after the calendar year. The almost called the age of one reason so yeah I mean it. Every song that we put on there what it was almost like a concept album you're living in a time. As we are today when all the things about religion has stood for all these years you know. Trying to create an enlightened society trying to create a society that that has the you know freedom of expression and follows hopefully data driven back to all information I mean these are if you look through our songs that's what we've been saying about all along so yeah in fact you put out a reimagining of faith alone last week I think great I love how you slow it down because now you really really. Need to listen to the lyrics search just there in your face the lyrics are and all of your looks a bit like that but it has been for the average listener a little bit of an effort to listen to the lyrics sometimes to the melody are you gonna do that again that give it the faith alone treatment to other songs. Well it's possible we do have some stuff lined up some releases that are coming up after street along with just came out and thank you for listening you know you're right it's slow down a little bit but the truth is you know a lot of the songs I write on piano and don is to guitar and so. They are they lend themselves to different styles different treatments and I recorded this one on my channel and send it off to break some bread to get indicted summer ranging and send it out to his friend you does string arrangements and. And then we send it to Jamie to play drums on it so I think that it it turned out really it's a cool way to collaborate while we're still distant but each of us has pretty good studio recording equipment at our own house is so. Nice your some other ideas like that that's great you actually answer 1 of my questions because you've always been early adopters I was wondering if you're gonna try to collaborate virtually and you are will will it be released like that or is that going to serve as a demo no I think if we collaborate like that it'll be finished mastered product like the lone 2020 but you. That's awesome that's great. But the burning question everybody in the punk rock world knows that you've gone into academia. Does your CV from cried out saying anything about that religion your students take classes from you because you are Greg Graf and from that religion I'm curious about that. Well I'm curious about that too because I never asked them. Okay. I don't bring it up they bring it up in office hours you know and they asked me about it and I think it's kind of cool but ultimately which I'm really happy about it you know whether your bad religion's fan or not. Evolution is one of the most important subjects you can take them down there taking it because they believe that in the. No they're not. By and large they're not there because of my outside interests they're there because I've gotten a reputation of being an easy professor. No that's not true I mean I am easy I think because I would like to see effort and I like just to see. Good deal I teach people to think critically and that's something that I can see reflected in your answers and other interest in the subject. So if I see that I I'm I tend to give a lot of. High marks for effort that's important to me. But also I just think that you know I was a graduate from any 4 year institution. Any any college or university evolution is one of the subjects that you really should now and regardless of your your beliefs it's one of the factual subjects that you really should now and because of that I get a really interesting crop of students from across the academic spectrum not just biologists so. You know because of that yeah maybe some of them are are interested in in taking it from me but. That's not at all discussed in the in the syllabus. Okay I I'm curious about over the state of the world is right now from your perspective your you discuss literature and history and all these other things and do what you want I'm curious to know where do you see us going if you look at like a dynasty you look at all the civilizations to increase the numbers wrong than the rest England China's up and coming do you think America's over or are we are we on the precipice of enlightenment or are we kind of on a downward spiral well I think if you want to talk about enlightenment the quest began not in America so it's really a human pursuit it's a human endeavor and I don't get very nationalistic when I speak academically. Most college campuses are indeed a melting pot of different nations from all over the world. And I think it's one of the most hopeful signs that we are getting and we have the opportunity to get closer and closer to the enlightenment objectives we are having an lightened global community. So in that respect. It is not over. But you know you have to put aside your nationalistic tendencies if you really believe in a better world because that's what what do universities are doing they're not indoctrinating they're not supposed to be indoctrinating. All into nationalism. They're supposed to be providing a way for humanity to think better and to think more critically and to face challenges objectively and to face the truth even though might be ugly face the truth of what it means to have a global society so I'm always optimistic about that and. Yeah. Whether or not an enemy all by the way I'll just say this if you wanna be if you want to be proud of America then be proud of the fact that we still have the best at least as of today we have a the best university system in the world. Let's hope that doesn't go south because the back goes south then not only is America doomed but this idea of a global enlightened community is also do that I you can't top that that's perfect I was curious you know do epitaph it was do it yourself and the studio you did it yourself but then you ended up going with hatchet I. at one of the biggest publishers in the world I am just kind of curious did you guys even think about self publishing are doing like epitaph. Literature yeah I mean I think Brett you know was always. Very optimistic about self publishing and. I'm not opposed to it but you do have your breasts also the best businessman so and the other guys in the band are very business oriented as well and I think you know my my opinion was not strong on the matter but they thought that you know there's a there's an industry that sells books out there they're set up for. We felt like that. If we did it ourselves it would be like another product that we're putting out we can be successful but we really want this book to sort of cross over so that the general public you may not know what the taxes will learn what I. My guest is being great graphical front man for the band Bad Religion Greg along with his bandmates have written a compelling book on the hard work and smart business that powered their success do what you want can be found on how to books and you can get it anywhere you buy books here's this week's lanterna. To expose the rock and roll was created written produced by yours truly in association with go 2 productions Charlene goto producer thank you to Greg Graffin and for being my guest and to the entire band for their support thanks also to Brett Gurewitz and Epitaph records for all of the music used on this episode and thank you to Michael and everyone at Hatchett book group. We love to hear from you please follow us on Instagram to see what's coming up on future tracks of the show and drop us a line while you're there you can find us online at text pros rock and roll.com and while you're there be sure to check out the soundtrack associated with S. episode with all music by badminton for text pros and rock and roll I'm Kris Kosach. Rock on.